Online Now 752

Wolverine247 Board

The place for discussion on the Michigan Wolverines

On this Board 534
Record: 2671 (1/26/2013)

Online now 800
Record: 7264 (3/12/2012)

Reply

Penn State Punishment Thread

  • Well, all bets are off if they don't count against the limit...then you might as well take 10 of those guys...can't hurt.

    www.neoavatara.com/blog

    neoavatara

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    This. It all comes down to how transfers from PSU count or don't count against scholarship limits. If they don't count, take every kid that is willing.

    From what i've read you can go over for that year, but then have to go under the next year.

    The example I read was if you were at your 85 scholarship limit and took on 3 PSU transfers you can go to 88 scholarships, however the following year you're restricted to just 82 scholarships.

    That wouldn't affect us though, we're only at 79 used so we could take on 6 kids without any issue. The problem comes into play with scholarships for the 2013 class. Since we have such a big recruiting class already those 6 scholarships, and the scholarships of all the graduating players (and more) have been accounted for. So if we bring on Zettel who will still be around the following year, that's one less scholarship to give out in '13, and one less recruit we can bring in.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by theyellowdart on 7/23/2012 at 9:25 AM

    signature image signature image signature image

    theyellowdart

  • neoavatara said...

    Well, all bets are off if they don't count against the limit...then you might as well take 10 of those guys...can't hurt.

    Yea. I think they have to count, but we will see.

    xxmgobluexx

  • I wouldn't be surprised to see the scholarship counts be effective in following years, but waivers being handed out extensively to that requirement.

    If a kid like Zettel wants to go to Michigan, but can't because of 2013 recruits, I bet he'll be able to get around the problem by petitioning the NCAA.

    bkp1883

  • theyellowdart said...

    From what i've read you can go over for that year, but then have to go under the next year.

    The example I read was if you were at your 85 scholarship limit and took on 3 PSU transfers you can go to 88 scholarships, however the following year you're restricted to just 82 scholarships.

    That wouldn't affect us though, we're only at 79 used so we could take on 6 kids without any issue. The problem comes into play with scholarships for the 2013 class. Since we have such a big recruiting class already those 6 scholarships, and the scholarships off all the graduating players (and more) have been accounted for. So if we bring on Zettle who will still be around the following year, that's one less scholarship to give out in '13, and one less recruit we can bring in.

    That doesn't make any sense. Hurt a program for taking kids from a program on fire?

    xxmgobluexx

  • bkp1883 said...

    I wouldn't be surprised to see the scholarship counts be effective in following years, but waivers being handed out extensively to that requirement.

    If a kid like Zettel wants to go to Michigan, but can't because of 2013 recruits, I bet he'll be able to get around the problem by petitioning the NCAA.

    So seniors would be ideal in that scenerio for not having an impact on future recruiting.

    xxmgobluexx

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    So seniors would be ideal in that scenerio for not having an impact on future recruiting.

    Give me all their DL and OL seniors/rs juniors!

    SuhOwnsYou

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    That doesn't make any sense. Hurt a program for taking kids from a program on fire?

    I think it's just their attempt to try and make things as fair as possible while still allowing any option to be open for the transferring student athletes.

    However, making the school "Pay double" for the transfered student their second year seems pretty dumb. However, that's just a report i've read thus far, doesn't mean I'm right. :) And again, it's a situation that won't affect Michigan.

    This post was edited by theyellowdart on 7/23/2012 at 9:30 AM

    signature image signature image signature image

    theyellowdart

  • One thing is for sure with this punishment, the NCAA made it clear that winning cannot be the ultimate goal of the program, and that to put winning above everything else (i.e. win at all costs) will come back to ruin you.

    Crazy day.

    Also read that the restriction on coaches talking to players about transferring has been lifted.

    I can't imagine what the players are going through. I would probably feel sick.

    signature image signature image signature image

    freernnur5

  • freernnur5 said...

    One thing is for sure with this punishment, the NCAA made it clear that winning cannot be the ultimate goal of the program, and that to put winning above everything else (i.e. win at all costs) will come back to ruin you.

    Crazy day.

    Also read that the restriction on coaches talking to players about transferring has been lifted.

    I can't imagine what the players are going through. I would probably feel sick.

    Zettel. Went to PSU because of the question marks at Michigan with RichRod and is now dealing with his present school being hit by the hardest penalties since SMU.

    xxmgobluexx

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    That doesn't make any sense. Hurt a program for taking kids from a program on fire?

    You can't give a team a competitive advantage of having 100 scholarships per year if they were to grab 15 PSU Sophomores and not have them count. So if you poach the young players you'd better make sure you have plenty of room.

    Dizzo

  • Dizzo said...

    You can't give a team a competitive advantage of having 100 scholarships per year if they were to grab 15 PSU Sophomores and not have them count. So if you poach the young players you'd better make sure you have plenty of room.

    Here is an article on the top 5 players on PSU. I think we could use them all minus the kicker.

    http://www.thebiglead.com/index.php/2012/07/23/penn-state-transfers-five-players-who-could-make-an-immediate-impact-in-2012/?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed

    Penn State Transfers: Five Players Who Could Make an Immediate Impact in 2012 | The Big Lead

    Penn State received a de facto death penalty. Players can transfer freely. Here is a look at five players who could attract a lot of interest, should they decide to hit the free agent market.

    www.thebiglead.com

    SuhOwnsYou

  • Too bad they don't have a big time Senior WR...we could use one of those.

    www.neoavatara.com/blog

    neoavatara

  • Alright, I'll be the vulture:

    SR DT - James Terry - Former 2* with a NT frame. Saw decent playing time last year for what was a pretty good defense.

    SR DT - Jordan Hill - Former 3* that would probably do well at either DT spot and has NFL aspirations. On several award watch lists.

    RS SR C - Matt Steinkewich - Only returning starter on their offensive line.

    SR WR - Justin Brown - Big kid who was a former 4* and fits Borges' mold. Possible NFL prospect.

    SR WR - Devon Smith - Slot-sized speedster.

    bkp1883

  • neoavatara said...

    Too bad they don't have a big time Senior WR...we could use one of those.

    They got two pretty decent senior WR. Would definitely see time, especially Justin Brown.

    bkp1883

  • bkp1883 said...

    Alright, I'll be the vulture:

    SR DT - James Terry - Former 2* with a NT frame. Saw decent playing time last year for what was a pretty good defense.

    SR DT - Jordan Hill - Former 3* that would probably do well at either DT spot and has NFL aspirations. On several award watch lists.

    RS SR C - Matt Steinkewich - Only returning starter on their offensive line.

    SR WR - Justin Brown - Big kid who was a former 4* and fits Borges' mold. Possible NFL prospect.

    SR WR - Devon Smith - Slot-sized speedster.

    As long as they stay under 85, I don't think it would effect them and if they take in Zettel they could just go for Treadwell and be done with the 2013 class.

    signature image signature image signature image

    Damaged goods

    MaizeandBlue21

  • bkp1883 said...

    Alright, I'll be the vulture:

    SR DT - James Terry - Former 2* with a NT frame. Saw decent playing time last year for what was a pretty good defense.

    SR DT - Jordan Hill - Former 3* that would probably do well at either DT spot and has NFL aspirations. On several award watch lists.

    RS SR C - Matt Steinkewich - Only returning starter on their offensive line.

    SR WR - Justin Brown - Big kid who was a former 4* and fits Borges' mold. Possible NFL prospect.

    SR WR - Devon Smith - Slot-sized speedster.

    I would go after both LBers too. I would like a little more depth there than soph and freshman if we can take two seniors.

    SuhOwnsYou

  • bkp1883 said...

    They got two pretty decent senior WR. Would definitely see time, especially Justin Brown.

    Well hell, I stand corrected. If the vultures are going to circle...we should at least consider these guys.

    www.neoavatara.com/blog

    neoavatara

  • bkp1883 said...

    Alright, I'll be the vulture:

    SR DT - James Terry - Former 2* with a NT frame. Saw decent playing time last year for what was a pretty good defense.

    SR DT - Jordan Hill - Former 3* that would probably do well at either DT spot and has NFL aspirations. On several award watch lists.

    RS SR C - Matt Steinkewich - Only returning starter on their offensive line.

    SR WR - Justin Brown - Big kid who was a former 4* and fits Borges' mold. Possible NFL prospect.

    SR WR - Devon Smith - Slot-sized speedster.

    jordan hill. come on down. can fill are need at DT for this year. hill and campbell in the middle. pipkins and black rotating in

    Wolverines89

  • bkp1883 said...

    The disadvantages PSU managed to avoid are also not consistent with the punishment.

    Is the NCAA punishing PSU for sheltering a child rapist or for lying to protect their football program?

    We have systems in place that are much better suited than the NCAA if its the former. The punishment isn't even remotely appropriate if it is the latter.

    The Baylor scandal(s) of the early 2000s should be a little instructive on this as well.

    The Baylor incident was brought out when it happened and their program was clearly decimated for several years. The PSU situation was not brought forward in order to avoid what happened at Baylor and in doing so more children were hurt.

    They are clearly punishing them for lying to protect the football program, in doing this they simultaneously protected a child rapist.

    I guess you feel not bringing this atrocity to light was not protecting the advantage the PSU brand had in recruiting athletes?

    Amazinglyblue78

  • SuhOwnsYou said...

    I would go after both LBers too. I would like a little more depth there than soph and freshman if we can take two seniors.

    Haha.

    Ryan, Demens, Morgan, Hawthorne, Gordon, and Jones are just not enough non-freshman depth.

    bkp1883

  • Amazinglyblue78 said...

    The Baylor incident was brought out when it happened and their program was clearly decimated for several years. The PSU situation was not brought forward in order to avoid what happened at Baylor and in doing so more children were hurt.

    They are clearly punishing them for lying to protect the football program, in doing this they simultaneously protected a child rapist.

    I guess you feel not bringing this atrocity to light was not protecting the advantage the PSU brand had in recruiting athletes?

    As to your last point, the PSU Brand has taken quite a hit, and up until now, they have recruited very well. So my opinion is that the cover up did not help them recruit.

    signature image signature image

    This is Michigan, fergodsakes.

    Never Lose Hoke

  • bkp1883 said...

    Haha.

    Ryan, Demens, Morgan, Hawthorne, Gordon, and Jones are just not enough non-freshman depth.

    Ryan and Demens are decent. I am not so sure on the rest.

    SuhOwnsYou

  • Amazinglyblue78 said...

    The Baylor incident was brought out when it happened and their program was clearly decimated for several years. The PSU situation was not brought forward in order to avoid what happened at Baylor and in doing so more children were hurt.

    They are clearly punishing them for lying to protect the football program, in doing this they simultaneously protected a child rapist.

    I guess you feel not bringing this atrocity to light was not protecting the advantage the PSU brand had in recruiting athletes?

    Well, not really. I think it was a big mistake followed by a decade and a half of covering up shit to protect their own asses. I think if the administration had been tipped off that a math professor was molesting kids that were coming in for tudoring, the path may have been very much the same.

    But again, is the NCAA punishing the university for lying to protect the football program, or punishing it for enabling and providing victims for a child molester?

    The punishment doesn't seem to apply for either.

    bkp1883

  • I would take Jordan Hill and probably Justin Brown, but otherwise I would rather not take up more spots and have to not give 5th years to some of our current seniors for transfers (if we were to take non seniors).

    signature image signature image signature image

    freernnur5