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Further confirmation of "The Cheating Decade of the Vest"

  • There's a kernel of truth in that, it's not that we suck though (in relative terms that's ridiculous, we are far more successful than a lot of the podunk teams in the South and on the Plains that have been found cheating in the past), it's that Michigan overall probably does care less about UofM than Ohio cares about the Buckeyes. I just read a description in a book about the rivalry essentially calling the Buckeyes' "Columbus' pro franchise", it was meant as a compliment reflecting the fact that the Buckeyes rule Columbus and many parts of rural Ohio alone basically whereas Michigan has to share the spotlight with the Detroit pro teams in the area.

    And of course the University of Michigan is not quite as dominated by football as OSU either, which probably has to do with the fact that Michigan has a slightly more cosmopolitan and worldly flair to it, being a "Public Ivy" and all that. Michigan is good at sports because it grew to be good at sports at a time when the real Ivy League and the service Academies were very good at sports and it was seen as the hallmark of a great university to also do well athletically. By the time the connection between academics and athletics basically ceased to exist, Michigan was a regional and national institution - but to this day there is this Ivy-esque snobbery and "above it all" mentality to Michigan.

    But the way I see college sports is that it has grown biggest, as in to essential religion status, where it is the outlet of provincial aspiration. Whether that's KU, Hoosier or Kentucky basketball, or Oklahoma, Alabama, LSU, Nebraska or OSU football. I think that contributes toward the best and the worst about college sports. On the positive side it brings a community together, it gives people a sense of pride and belonging, it may inspire people to do great things for their community. On the negative side, it can encourage myopia, ruthless ambition and oneupmanship, smalltown boosterism mixed with a tasty cocktail of municipal corruption. Columbus is no smalltown but it's a big city without big city flair or fame. OSU is a respected university but not famous or extremely prestigious either nationally or internationally. Buckeye football is OSU is Columbus.

    As a result OSU *is* almost certainly more corrupt than Michigan, which doesn't mean I can guarante everything is 100% kosher at Michigan but it's a matter of degree. We've had our issues, but the reality is that Ohio is packed with people who want OSU to win more than anything else in the world, who would do almost anything toward that goal. And I don't mean internet fanboys, I mean people with businesses, people in respected professions. There are obviously exceptions and there are Michigan fanatics like that but I think it's pretty obvious there's a lot more Buckeyes who fit that description than there are Wolverines.

    Does that exempt Tressel from responsibility? Not necessarily. I think he did what he felt he had to do to win as big as possible. I don't think he went out of his way to make sure no improper benefits were given to players, in fact, I'd think that he most likely intentionally turned a blind eye to it. He turned a blind eye to Pryor and co. running with a bad crowd, so I would assume that was the standard M.O. Much like Pete Carroll did at USC who ran a notoriously "open" program or all the guys at Miami in the past as well. As long as you never get caught directly as a program engaging in these things the penalties will be tolerable and business as usual will soon resume. That was SMU's mistake, there was so much cheating back then that people got away with, so SMU grew arrogant and all but ran their program as a pro team without making sure there's nothing linking the program as an institution to these issues. Teams have learned from that and that's why the death penalty won't happen again.

    With regards to Penn State, it's easy to judge but in truth no fan of a CFB powerhouse should want to try the hypothesis that at their program this couldn't have happened.

  • A forum with Michigan , Penn State and OSU posters, all great Institutions but yet all 3 have and or are suffering probations/penalties. IMO there are only a handful of programs that are what I would call ‘Intentionally Dirty” and none of those are in the B1G. Who knows what Tressel was thinking with Clarett, did he think he could change him or was it just a tolerate him because he had so much talent? If it was the latter remember that Clarett only lasted 1 year and only played 7 games before he was gone from the team.

  • The part of your accusations against Tressel that don't hold up is all of those "rule breakers" at OSU were suspended for their transgressions. Clarett, kicked off team, Troy Smith, suspended, Holmes, suspended. Now why he chose to lie about Pryor I have no idea. Maybe he was feeling the pressure of expectations and lost sight, but he paid the price I would say.

    As far as Clarett, his story has changed with the wind. Every time he has felt scorned, he talks about driving a Lexus etc... When he was busted at tOSU, the car he had made the false burglary claim on was a 5-7 year old POS with a decked out stereo system....so, if he was being given Lexus' and such why was he in some beater? This lates story is the first time I've heard him say he made more money in college than any other time, drove a Lexus, etc....I'm NOT saying he's lying, I'm just not one to fully believe what this guy says, as he has been nothing credible his entire life.

    It's a shame, he was a great talent but honestly probably should never have stepped on a college campus. Wherever he went was going to be dealing with this.

  • Three cars at a time and taking three outdoors class per semester not intentional? Give me a break you are clearly still drinking large amounts of the kool-aid if that's not intentionally cheating. Maybe since it only lasted 1 year and 7 games it wasn't long enough for an Ohio fan to consider it intentional.

  • Oh goodness, you people are so self-righteous. I've already discussed elsewhere how logically stupid it is for people to say that, because of what happened at PSU, I suddenly can't comment on other situations. Not that being logically stupid has ever stopped an OSU fan.

    A spade is a spade, whether it's me pointing it out or someone else.

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  • Took this to PM since neither of us are Michigan fans and this is a Michigan board.

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  • No worries, we all agree that you're well within your rights to comment on any subject, and the Bucknut is being ridiculous.

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  • Why would you keep an account for 22 months just to post this? confused

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  • Take this crap off our board!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  • OSU has most certainly had issues with extra benefits - well documented, and there is little defense to these findings. It cost tOSU a coach, scholarships, and integrity.

    I get it; however, to think tOSU is the only program with these issues is crazy talk. Keep in mind it wasn't long ago that several sites (Sports by Brooks & Out Kick the Coverage) had photos of Julio Jones cruising in a Cadi while momma worked at KFC. Not to mention all the photos of Bama players signing Items for the "T-Town" owners shop, which he openly said he was selling. Least we forget the Cam Newton debacle or the other Auburn players claims of bags of cash.

    I guess my point is, if the NCAA really wanted to "catch" schools in the wrong, there would definetly be some big time programs in trouble.

    Makes you wonder who actually presses the NCAA to probe certain schools while others get swept under the rug.