Wolverine247 Board

I think Urban really can't be evaluated on the strength of the 2012 class. If Penn State doesn't have the mother of all school scandals, Urban doesn't get Spence, Reeves, Schutt, O'Connor, and Williams. 2013 is more indicative of how Urban will recruit when a quarter of his class doesn't just fall into his lap because their original school goes to hell.

Get out. I seriously don't have enough downvotes for this, nor am I allowed to use the sort of language that post deserves.

Dukes is blue. Michigan has always been the team he wanted to play for, and he was one of the first of this class to commit. I don't care if Michigan has to turn down Larue, Daniels, Treadwell, and Foster, that scholarship had better be waiting for Dukes as promised.

+1

Coaches can't tell kids to not take visits if they are going to turn around and pull scholarships. It would be a contradiction to everything they are preaching. I don't see these coaches just yanking an offer if they accepted a kid's commitment. Situations like Standifer are different because there ap obviously ended up being qualification issues since he got dropped by ND as well and ended up at Ole Miss.

The fact that people are talking about it shows the buck nuts accomplished something .... move along people.

I see what you did there...

His lack of success after Tebow had everything to do with not having a running threat in Brantley. 99% of the running game in his offense is built around the zone read. If you don't have a running threat at QB, it's a useless play. That also eliminated a good chunk of their pass plays.

Meyer only won at UF because of Zook's players? LOLWUT? So your BCS win last year was all on Rich Rod?

Winning with players left behind by a fired coach speaks to your strengths as a coach, not the other way around.

" If Penn State doesn't have the mother of all school scandals, Urban doesn't get Spence, Reeves, Schutt, O'Connor, and Williams."

How do you know we wouldn't have gotten all those guys if we didn't have our mess? Too many ifs, ands, or buts in that statement.

The point is that its not Urban's presence that flipped all of those recruits. If you hadn't had your mess (which was a bit of a different situation than the one at PSU), Urban wouldn't have flipped those recruits either.

Its far too early to tell much at this point, but I'm gonna be looking for every sign that you guys got all of the arrogance of younger Urban without the tireless dedication. If things turn out to be harder than he initially expected, that whole situation could blow up.

So far with this 2013 recruiting class, it kinda looks like he kinda started counting his chickens before they hatched, at least that's how I look at it.

FWIW Urbie stole ND's OL coach and TE coach (who was Decker's primary recruiter) right around the same time Decker flipped. Coincidence? I think not.

I didn't say there was anything wrong with it. There was nothing wrong with flipping any of the other guys either IMO. Hell, we went after Reeves. But you are naive if you think OSU's hiring away of NDs OL and TE coaches did not play a role in Decker's decision. That is all I am saying. Many, many planets aligned perfectly at the tail end of 2012 and made Urbie appear to be some sort of rockstar recruiter when, in fact, he's probably no better or worse than most HCs at elite programs.

Well, so far this year, Urbie's been on the losing end of the decommitment fun. But be sure to come back and let us know the next time he flips 7-8 commits in a single class.

I think we're arguing towards the same conclusion here. I completely agree with everything you've said, especially that Urban's hiring of Decker's coaches played a major role in his flip. Everything I've seen so far in 2013 just indicates that without the stars aligning the way they did in 2012, Urban isn't recruiting any better than your average HC at an elite program - it seems like he's not doing much that the OSU name alone wouldn't already be doing.

And before any Bucknut comes and talks about pulling Baugh out of CA or Barrett out of TX, let's keep in mind that another coach could've stayed at home to get Zaire (and keep him away from a rival) as well as snag two solid TEs in Heuerman and McNeil if he didn't completely botch their recruiting and make them both feel unwanted. I repeat - to me, nothing he's done seems like something that the OSU name wouldn't do alone.

I think 2014 is when we can really judge Meyer's recruiting. 2012 has to be thrown out bc he came in at the end, had to accept the commitments of lesser players bc of the turmoil, and also the PSU mess

2013 is his first full year. He didn't have the chance to build relationships with the guys as juniors like other schools in the area have. He's missed on a ton of guys, but I don't think it's all his fault.

That's why I say 2014. He will have had the chance to contact the guys for a full year so any misses are really bad.